Last job killed my love of IT, management beat it out of me. Wonderful company, demotivated by my manager from the first week. Couldn’t be a nicer guy, smartest tech I’ve ever met, Peter Principled his was into management.
Never been paid that much, took about every Friday off on PTO, total WFH, can’t say what my benefits cost but it wasn’t $100/mo. in total. My last job was half the pay and benefits, was so much happier. I think of that every time I read a comment about why companies need to pay more to satisfy us. Everyone should have a look at this. Had ALL that at my penultimate job, NONE at the most recent.
I feel so weird, especially at this time of life with a solid resume, interviewing for PT work at Lowe’s. Thinking I’ll be happier than a pig in shit spending 4 hours a day, just walking around helping people, doing what ever bullshit I’m asked to do. Looking to see how it goes, see if there are ways to work myself up to FT, better schedule, supervisor, whatever.
Thought about “retiring” to work in a hardware store to keep busy and fit, but not for a decade+. Excepting my credit card bills, and what my wife sends home to the Philippines, she makes enough to cover everything. Won’t take much to take the edge off.
I love hardware and tools and plants, about everything they sell. Hoping to learn a lot as well. Helping people is really satisfying to me, and I’m excellent at handling customers. LOL, I’m best with the angry ones, sometimes get them apologizing. :)
Need a sanity check, am I losing it!? Been through the worst depression of my life the past few years, hoping this will break me back into a normal state of mind.
EDIT: Got the job! Holy shit, the assistant manager is just like me! Dropped out of tech to take a minimum wage job at Lowe’s 8 years ago, now he’s at $90K. We’ve even done much of the same work in the IT space. “I did DSL for Bellsouth when it was new!” “Yep, did my time as a cable internet guy.”
Seems to be a lot of space and opportunity to move up. I’m going to knock this out the fucking park!
BONUS: Clerk at the shady gas station overhead me telling my neighbor about quitting IT and getting hired today. Guy ask me what I did in IT, gave him a run down. “Yeah. I was a web dev for 20-years, couldn’t take staring at a screen any more.”
High Tech Low Life… Gas Station Clerk Freelancing as Web Dev with 20 yrs of experience.
You’re not crazy. If you’re making enough to live on and you’re happy, then I’m not sure what else a person could ask for.
For my part, I have a decent job in healthcare, making a good salary by any measure, but it’s emotionally strenuous on the best of days and I dream of quitting to go start a flower farm. The bad days are utterly soul-sucking, so I absolutely cannot do this kind of work for another 18 years (when I’ll turn 54 too), so I fully intend to do similarly to you once I am financially secure enough. Definitely not retail for me though; I got enough of that in my college days. 😛
In the words of another man who left IT for manual labor:
You have no idea how much more sane that made me feel.
At my last two jobs people will always leave to become farmers or carpenters.
Left IT to become a machinist… Best decision of my life (38).
Best decision of your life, so far.
You are correct :)
Huh, I did the opposite. We all have different needs but I admit I recently chose to go down salary by $20k because of stress.
Word of caution.
I’ve gone down this route and discovered the phrase “you’re overqualified”, which is bandied around when you describe your previous experience.
Don’t let this dissuade you, just keep it in mind.
Good luck with the job interview!
That’s my only worry. Not sure how to downplay that or express that this really sounds like what I want (I think), even at the massive pay cut.
“Overqualified” just means they’re afraid you know your rights and can’t be exploited like someone fresh out of school.
But if they’re already entertaining the idea of hiring someone in their 50’s I doubt you’ll hear it very often if at all.
No, it means you might run off at any moment when a higher paying job presents itself.
I got the job! Going to hang in there, see where it leads. I was astounded at the mobility, up and lateral, that I can probably score.
I did retail a while ago. It wasn’t hard to climb if you’re moderately competent and not a d-bag. There is a somewhat low ceiling from what I recall. At my store at least, most of the people that reached upper level store managerial roles tended to do so by opening a new location.
gratz.
god damn I keep typing out advice … Enjoy yourself. \o/
as an ex-IT currently working at Lowes, they don’t really give a shit about your qualifications, and probably won’t even ask. passing the drug test and background check is about the only qualifications that matter to them.
But Dunkin, man. Dunkin always finds out.
Quality of Life, Life Balance, something like that?
Quality of Life working from retail?
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahabahahahahahaha
No no no sorry …hahahahahahahahahahahah HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Some people actually enjoy that kind of work. I did it for a few years and I loved every minute of it. I enjoyed helping people and talking and organizing shelves/racks whatnot. If it paid better I’d probably still be doing it.
Where’d you work though? This guy is going to work for Walmart equivalent of home improvement stores. After working at Walmart myself as a first job, I quickly grew to detest the place and quit twice before actually leaving (they talked me into staying the first time with a transfer and raise). It’s a soul sucking environment without the high pay and benefits that OP is walking away from. I hope it works out but the phrase “the grass is greener on the other side” exists for a reason.
A place called Tuesday Morning. Kind of a old lady type place. They sold a bit of everything from clothes to knick knacks and home deco, but for like old people lol. Def no Lowe’s but I enjoyed it. Maybe OP should look for somewhere like Ace hardware instead?
Ace would be recommended. They hire people who want to help, Lowes hires people who have to pretend to want to help.
just lie to them?
My story is literally the opposite. Working at places like Lowes and the shitty coworkers and management was my drive to finish school and get a better job.
Every job can suck because of people who suck. Retail is definitely NOT better. I ain’t saying it’s worse, but it ain’t better.
Controversial but when it actually IS essentially just “for spending money” part time work, is retail that bad? You have the psychological benefits of seeing new people, having consistent relationships, helping others, physical activity, a routine, and anything else that working may bring to your social calendar. Oh and waaaay less responsibility and pressure.
Cause it is essentially working for mental health reasons instead of financial. It is a lot easier to walk away then as soon as mental health is compromised!
I think the people hating on retail haven’t developed people skills because they’re young or simply can’t. I can flip an angry customer around in a few minutes, have them eating out of my hand.
The secret sauce? Treat like as what they are, a human being coming to you for help, not pain-in-the-ass customer #43 for the day. Even the ones that start out angry quickly catch on that you’re on their side and doing your damnedest to help. If you’re fake, they can smell it.
People skills might be part of the equation, but that also applies to IT/dev work too - especially if you find yourself in any kind of lead (tech and/or managerial) position.
I think hesitancy you’re seeing comes down to earnings potential and the fact that our society tends to look down on “low skill” work, especially retail.
I’m glad you have that particular skill, but it absolutely has very little to do with irate customers. That’s more like what makes it a shitty day at the job vs having a shitty job.
Also idk how much variety of people you have had to meet in your career but I venture to guess they are all generally the same socioeconomic backgrounds, education, etc. When you work with the public it is different, the pool is larger and more random, you may learn new ways people can be fucking weird.
If you’re financially stable enough to actually throw hands with that one customer (who will show up in your life eventually), then yeah, I can understand that.
I had a similar arc, but I would be lying if I said I wasn’t thinking about going back.
I worked retail for two years post highschool. Looking at my coworkers, some of whom were in their 40s/50s and still at pretty low level positions, made me go to community college and then a four year school.
14 years later working on software (dev, highly engaged/invested PO, now PM) and I either have a more clear-eyed worldview or a my company is starting to fall apart. I’m very over our command and control leadership that’s been touting the next new framework only to continue to command and control in that framework and then claim “that framework was actually bad, this new framework is good”. The battling between teams building basically the same things, but for their niches of the world, “how I want it” coming every which was as opposed to thinking about what we should be solving, everything being the top priority, actions mattering more than results, etc. Layer in process debt that goes back to the 1950s and technical debt going back to the 1980s. I know younger companies don’t have the later two problems, but from lurking in dev related communities for years everything else seems pretty common.
At my retail job the worst I had to deal with was the occasional grouchy customer, which just meant calling a manager to deal with it if I couldn’t. We’re doing the best we can to stash away money. We’ve started doing math to say, “we might have to work longer in total, but if we were to take lower paying jobs at <age> this is what our finances would look like”.
Dude, if you’re happy and can survive, you made the right move.
Working in IT has me questioning my entire existence. In many ways, I envy you.
As someone who just got his A+ certification and is looking for his first job in IT, why do/did you feel this way?
I am doing a career switch from marketing/SEO which was…! Manipulating everything for people to sell shit and my job is beholden to whatever the FUCK Google wants to do today? No thanks!
It depends A LOT what kind of IT career you do. If you are a sysadmin with a shitty manager/company you’ll hate it. If you do helpdesk you’ll hate the whole human race.
But you can become devops, SRE, cloud engineer, architect, so you get all the fun at tinkering without the bullshit (most of the time, no job is perfect).
Well, I’ll have to start out in help desk but I’ve done CS as a temp job before and it was kind of fun. I don’t want to do help desk forever though, and I understand just how DUMB some people can be. Like, wow… 🤣
I dunno, I’m excited to get started in it and I don’t know what I want to specialize in yet.
If you enjoy tech, keep going for it. There’s nothing inherently shitty about the work, at any level, and it pays. As with any career, we sometimes burn out.
Thank you! I think it’s a career right up my alley and I’m excited to land my first gig - hopefully in the next couple of months.
I worked in email marketing for JP Morgan for a few years. Most miserable job I ever had. All work from home and super short hours but I couldn’t live with all the information manipulation that was going on. It’s ridiculous how much personal info people give up online without even realizing it and that was 10 years ago. I can only imagine how bad it is now.
Yeah, I’m sure on the email side it’s ridiculous!
My experience is that ITs role is to manage organizational liability, not helping people. Perhaps i am naive, but i wanted a job in tech so that i could help support other people in doing amazing work. You do get to do that, but it needs to be constantly framed from that point of organizational liability in order to effect any change. Different orgs have different risk appetites and cultures that make that change easier or harder.
tbh i would still start a carrer in tech, i do not want to dissuade you from such. For me i was better able to navigate the day to day bullshit after i learned what they are actually paying me for vs the dream i had in my head.
That depends on what you do.
My job is mainly to keep things rolling and improve them, but also support to a certain degree.
Our support team’s job is obviously to help people.
Not much of what we do is motivated by liability. But I work in the public(ish) sector.
Thank you for that info. I’ll keep it in mind. I’ve worked for various corporations for over 20 years, so I know they all are about self preservation.
Well at least now you can work in a hands-on environment and hopefully use your marketing skills to manipulate your management chain into doing what’s right for you or the company.
That’s what I’m excited to do is hands-on stuff. I’ve built my own PC and have sort of torn my wife’s Mac apart when troubleshooting a heating issue. Doing things with the CLI or remoting in will be cool too!
Nah, not crazy. In my view anyway. In 2020 I left nursing in CA making close to $100k and paid zero for actually amazing insurance… to work part time at a bakery for roughly $23/hr in Norway. I was 39.
Sometimes we just have enough and we don’t need to keep chasing the dollars in favor of a simpler, cozier life.
How did you move to Norway? Afaik you can’t just show up to stay permanently.
You’re right, it is actually quite uncommon for Americans to live here without special circumstances. My husband is in tech, and managed to get hired on here, and so we are here on his work visa. We can test for citizenship after 7 years residency and testing language and civics, which we plan to do in about 3 years. We know that we are very lucky.
Norway has much nicer benefits and lower cost if living than California
Cost of living isn’t off by too terribly much haha. Our 2bd 1ba apartment is about half the cost that our 3bd 2ba duplex in Bay Area was. But we make substantially less. Also a hamburger, for reference, is routinely about $20 without fries, like for a Five Guys kind of burger. So we don’t eat out nearly as much. Healthier that way anyway. Lots of trade offs but ultimately it is the best and safest place I’ve ever lived.
Are you a citizen in Norway? Asking because that sounds nice
Not yet, but we can test (language and civics) in about 3 years which we plan to do. We are currently “temporary residents” and renew every two years. My husband has a work visa to work in tech here, and I’m here tied to that visa through family reunification. We will apply for “permanent” residency (not citizenship yet) later this year.
Gives me hope about a visa thanks for the response
That’s literally the plot of Stardew Valley. Leaving the world of digital work in favor of something more tangible is a dream come true for many of us.
I used to have a white-collar job and now work in retail. You know what I love? 1) If there’s a problem, it’s my manager’s problem. I am entry level by choice, and have as little responsibility as possible. 2) Work stays at work. The second I clock out, I stop giving a damn about that place. 3) On the rare occasion I get a call from work, I always screen it. If some jackass didn’t show up, and I don’t feel like going in, I simply don’t call back.
I like my job. I like the people I work with. I’m pleasant and helpful to our customers. Maintaining boundaries helps keep it that way.
You’re living the dream… and I’m right behind you.
Just hit 58 and I’m still working in tech (not IT any more, but adjacent). In March I’m going to tell them that I’ll be working fewer hours. Not asking, telling.
It’s their choice whether I work zero hours or some number that’s less than the 80 I’m currently putting in. I’ll either have 3-day weekends or 7-day weekends.
Theres a reason behind the “retire and herd goats” joke for IT. Burnout sucks. Sounds like your needs will be met financially, enjoy it!
17 years in tech. Made it to director level. Decided I hated ladder climbing. Transitioned to software engineering full time and spent the last 5 years doing that. The work life balance was a lot better but the corporate BS was not. I’ve decided corporate jobs may not be for me.
Currently working on a software project of my own. If that works out, great. If not, I may get out of the business instead of going to another corporate job. I’ve got enough experience to do just about anything I want to but I honestly don’t know what that would be.
Are you me? Currently at the director level debating a switch back to dev. Prior director in my role did the same. I actually love my boss and when I’m empowered to run my org, the work is great. But too much of my job is trying to insulate my teams from the BS and it’s burning me out. But I’m not sure I’d want to give up being able to fight the BS and would eventually get frustrated by it again as a dev.
So here I am, riding it out. I know at some point politics will get me and my style of insulating my engineers will cost me my job, even though by doing so we have great productivity metrics. And being real - I think the hardest part is that by shielding my teams from the BS, I become the face for the shit that does get through so the people I fight so hard to protect often blame me for their very real complaints.
I’m not sure what’s next for me, but I save everything I can because I assume that the change might not be my choice.
I know at some point politics will get me and my style of insulating my engineers will cost me my job, even though by doing so we have great productivity metrics.
Mine ultimately did cost me my job. Or at least it was a contributing factor. I was so sick of the relentless conflict and the toxicity. When I eventually got fired, I missed my team but I was also relieved. It was like a huge weight being lifted. Knowing what I know now, I would never have taken the job to begin with. On the other hand, I do think it helped me grow personally and figure out what my values are. I decided I was ready to put my career on the line if I had to choose between keeping my job and doing the right thing. I did the best I could and my conscience is clear.
The best job to have is the one that you don’t need. I was fortunate enough to retire early from a high stress job. I didn’t hate the job. I just had enough. After 3 months I was bored. Got myself a part time job. And as was mentioned in an earlier comment, if the place burns down I couldn’t care less. I’m always on time, never sick, and good at my mickey mouse part time job because it’s a joke compared to the real job I had. It is fascinating to observe my fellow workers who are all very nice people because for them THIS is their career and for me it’s just a throw away to get out of the house.
Wayyyy ahead of you pal. Got into tech when I was a wee little lad, my dad would bring home computers from the work dumpster, hand me a screw driver and let me go at it.
When I was 11 I built a computer with my dad, and continued learning about tech and computers. I worked after school in middle school to help out the librarian, who had the job of looking after the laptops and computer carts.
Went into highschool and got into a Comptia± honors class, as the only freshman and the only person to get As in that class.
Fresh after highschool and 6 months into a computer job, I quit at the age of 19. Instead I went to pursue woodworking.
I had a great boss, and I was great at my job, but I was in computer repair. A dying industry and I was getting paid minimum wage, despite a lot of skill (microsoldering, logic board rework, macbook repair, liquid damage repair, etc).
Skill and knowledge that I studied for a decade, and I was being paid minimum wage. There were probably better opportunities but I wasn’t interested anymore. The environment was just far too corporate, so I decided to start building my own business, woodworking, selling tools, and help teach.
Ive gone to tool events, tuned up a lot of tools, and given presentations and its 10x more fulfilling. Havent made a lot from the “business” but I’m happy.
I’m near my 40s, and have been working as software dev since finishing my masters. Few years back I started to go in the direction of more management less dev in a previous company. Saw it wasn’t for me and went to work somewhere else working as a simpler dev role. A few years after and I’m starting to feel the need to change further even. I do love coding but the whole layer of tech debt and management and meetings is wearing me out and has made me lose my love for tech. I am just lost as to what I’d do instead. Cannot work on retail with my autistic ass and since WFH was allowed and accepted I am not planning to go back to an office anyway. Maybe woodworker or something would be enjoyable for me, but there’s other constraints that won’t allow me to change right now, lots of bills to pay and my wife is an entrepreneur so we can’t really risk losing my stable position right now, with two small kids. Once they grow and get out of the house we’d likely move more country side, get some chicken to care for (we love animals) or something like that and maybe I can get space to do some wood work or whatever come to mind then.
So overall, no, you are not losing it, or maybe we are all losing it together. Same with depression, it’s such a tough shit to leave behind. I’m still fighting with it but doing better lately, the job doesn’t help at all…
Also a tech worker considering a major pivot. I have a fascination with electrical work so I’m wondering if taking on an apprenticeship might give me a chance to dip my toes in.
