- cross-posted to:
- usa@lemmy.ml
- usa@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- usa@lemmy.ml
- usa@lemmy.ml
But why?! The USA is a paradise for women! Isn’t that what Margaret Atwood taught us!?
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Online surveys that ask women if they want to leave the United States often produce misleading results for several reasons.
First, these surveys capture wishful thinking rather than actual plans. When people answer an online poll, they respond based on imagination rather than commitment. Saying you want to move to another country is similar to saying you want to live on a beach or work fewer hours. It reflects a fantasy, not a genuine intention.
Second, these surveys attract people who are already dissatisfied or curious about change. This creates a self selected group that does not represent the population as a whole. If someone is bored, stressed, or daydreaming about a different lifestyle, they are more likely to click the poll.
Third, many respondents interpret the question emotionally rather than practically. Wanting to “leave the country” can actually mean wanting a break, wanting adventure, or wanting to travel. It rarely means navigating visas, finding new jobs, learning new languages, or building a life abroad. Travel and exploration are appealing because they offer novelty without long term consequences. True immigration requires commitment that most people never make.
Because of these factors, online polls mainly reveal a desire for change or travel rather than a real plan to emigrate. They reflect mood and curiosity, not a solid decision to leave the country.
The real shocker is the number of people who don’t.
Personally, I consider it a civic duty to help fix the country instead of abandoning it. If all the good people leave, things are gonna get way worse, and it’s gonna start leaking all over the planet.
True, true. It was “want” to leave though.
I can see that, but if the want to stay eclipses the want to leave, arithmetically I consider that a net “want” to stay.
True, true…
Do you always run away from your battles? It’s not about wanting to fight, or get hurt… It’s about wanting a better country, and a better world.
Me? No. I don’t live in a shithole country. I really hope Americans can fix their shit so it stays that way.
Unless you can alter laws about corporations, lobbying, and billionaires, the USA is going to be changed by good people staying there. The power of the people is now a facade, you’ll get arrested for domestic terrorism charges or something
I will agree with that statement 100%
however, there’s a caveat where if someone’s personal safety and life are at risk by the state, there’s absolutely no shame in fleeing.
also the “stay and fix your country” is usually a racist dogwhistle. I am assuming you don’t mean it like that. just bringing it up
I’ve been doing that since Clinton and all I see is people clamoring for “centrist” candidates who are now so far right, “center” is right of Nixon.
Is “stay and fix your country” a racist dog whistle? I wouldn’t imagine racists would really consider leaving in the first place.
I believe he meant the racism was in saying that to people to be anti immigration. As in: we don’t want people from mexico coming to america! Stay and fix your own country!
If everyone was like that, wed have little ability to immigrate anywhere
it’s used against immigrants or refugees. “they should stay there and fix their problems”
Ah. Well, considering I’m referring to my own strategy, I think I’m safe.
yhea, I assumed so. didn’t mean to accuse you.
It’s already affecting the planet in extreme ways. I’m with you, we have to stay as long as there’s a chance we can help.
I agree and in the case of the us I think the onus is a bit higher considering our history. Folks were here before us and folks are here because of us and the least we can do is not be a shit show.
Im not a woman and im not young but I would love to be somewhere else. Honestly I sorta worry whats happening here is being mirrored elsewhere so in a few years it may not matter.
It’ll get exported faster if we don’t stay and face it. We already have the biggest military in the world, by an order of magnitude; we’re not post-WWI Germany. If fascism takes hold here, the whole world is cooked.
yeah. I have peppered through my comment history how I would like to leave but its a quandry since sensible folk abandoning the country would lead to less sensible folks.
This is our home, not their home. Fuck the fascists.
We aren’t all cowards like the people in charge.
Or would if the could afford it.
truly shocking. Who’d have thunk treating a demographic like shit and taking away all their rights would cause them to leave!?
Who’d have thunk treating a demographic like shit and taking away all their rights would cause them to leave!?
And yet enabled by other women
https://truthout.org/articles/yes-55-percent-of-white-women-voted-for-trump-no-im-not-surprised/
Yes, 55 Percent of White Women Voted for Trump. No, I’m Not Surprised.
It’s time to stop coddling white women when they bolster white supremacy, and to push for concrete acts of solidarity.
Yeah, I get why women don’t want to live here, particularly in states that have banned abortion. It’s fucked up, and I don’t fault them for abandoning their country.
I do hope enough of us keep fighting, though.
I know, right? That’s obviously not how people really behave!
I have a good American friend here in Germany who has a great chance of getting a permanent status and later citizenship. She’s already pretty good at German after 2 years and was offered a permanent local contract. She told me last week she’s probably not taking the offer and going back to the US because she earns more and pays less taxes there. I asked about healthcare cost and all she talked about was how contraception was completely free in her american insurance and she has a copay here, how much less taxes she paid and she didn’t like how the German law handles paternity issues (it’s harder to get out of your obligations if your wife cheated and the kid isn’t yours).
It was so weird. So many American women wish they were in her position and all she talked about was going back to the US due to paternity laws and the 10€ copay on her contraception which made her really angry for some reason.
People be stupid, yo! I decided in 1999 I’d never again set foot on US soil because I’d rather pay higher taxes and have a sane society around me.
And now I pay lower taxes than a USAnian and have a sane society around me.
Don’t you miss it sometimes, not living in constant fear that someone with an AR15 could have a bad day near you or your loved ones?
I never did have that fear. I’ve never lived in the USA.
Now if things get much hotter I might have a minor niggling fear that a US bomb will drop on my head, but for now not even Trump and his coterie are stupid enough to let things get that far.
Where is this magical place, if you don’t mind saying? I’d love to live there. :)
Me personally, I live in Wuhan.
Awesome, thanks for answering!
she didn’t like how the German law handles paternity issues (it’s harder to get out of your obligations if your wife cheated and the kid isn’t yours).
Major red flag for her partner lol
I don’t believe this would be a major opinion by any woman I have ever known. This is likely a fictitious post.
Why? She thinks it should be more in favor of the man and he should be able to easily up and leave anytime after finding out the kid isn’t his.
I guess… But why even care about that unless you plan to cheat? I feel like most people would never even know that’s a thing. There’s really only one reason someone would look that up.
I’m afraid this one reason might be much more common that you seem to think.
Didn’t say it was uncommon
Right, just pointing out that if it’s common then it might be worth caring about even if it doesn’t affect you personally.
Its USA brainwashing, they feel they are fighting the “enemy” by not paying tax. Even though that extra take home pay ends up going to health care, or car expenses due to lack of transit etc.
It comes from the idea that our government is so inherently corrupt that they can’t be trusted to do anything correctly with our money, so people would rather keep their money and spend it on themselves directly.
And I have to say these people are justified, our government doesn’t spend our money on worthwhile things.
I think the systems where people pay higher taxes usually work better, tho.
We don’t even need to raise taxes. All the money we need for social services is in the military budget that hasn’t passed a successful audit this century.
Yeah, we have literally all the money we need to pay for all our social services.
We spend as much as the next 7 largest militaries COMBINED.
It’s such a massive grift, and we can’t touch the military budget because it’s the only form of welfare that works and tons of Americans NEED it.
I’d be fine with our military expenditures if we used them for civil engineering in peacetime… And I guess we would have to stop those pesky undeclared wars as a happy knock on effect.
we spend more on healthcare than the military last i checked (but again, no audit on DoD spending so…)
Even so, that’s ~800 billion that could be used for social services and improving lives.
Also if we’re so skint that we can’t afford to take care of the basics…how did we find all that ICE money? After a massive revenue cut, also!
People are emotional creatures.
People also don’t seem to accept that you often get something for paying taxes. Infrastructure, schools, food inspectors, whatever.
Yikes. Does she wear a MAGA hat? She sounds like the type.
No, actually she worked on one of Kamala Harris’ campaigns and proudly wears the campaign tshirt. Which is why her attitude confused me so much. I’m not sure what’s going on with her other than that even a well educated American can still have a lot of indoctrination and believe the American way is always the best way.
Leftist groups in China have learned not to engage with American leftist groups since the 2020 Pride fiasco in Shanghai. American groups always act as if they know better than locals what local conditions are, what local culture will or will not tolerate, and what tactics will or will not work under local conditions. The LGBT community spent decades on patient diplomacy winning all kinds of victories (like queer sex being removed from criminal law and queerness being removed as a mental disorder) for themselves. Then in 2009 they got persuaded by American LGBT groups to hold Pride events. And when that didn’t get stomped, to get more and more confrontational and strident in them.
Until in 2020 the authorities had had enough and stomped. Hard. Undoing at least three decades of the patient diplomacy in the process.
Now leftist groups in China do the polite “nod, smile, ignore” cycle when told by Americans how to run their affairs.
even a well educated American can still have a lot of indoctrination and believe the American way is always the best way.
I think this is it too.
Can’t imagine why…. So odd…
The irony is the Conservatives wanted women’s rights removed and have them back at home to make white babies, because they fear the mixed culture. And they may now be left with a country mostly made of men, which will obviously shrink their baby birthing plan.
Can confirm. Moved from the Midwest and dated a Mexican, family “othered” me from that point onward. That relationship didn’t work out for unrelated reasons but now being with a French, can also confirm we would both love to move to his country, but the place we can make the most positive impact is, unfortunately, here. We don’t plan on having kids because we understand it does truly take a village and that kind of support doesn’t exist in the U.S. especially not now. Breaks my heart because he would make an amazing dad.
And nobody will have babies with economy bad because women at home. But that’s too complicated for them.
Yeah, I would too if I went on a road trip across the country and gained and lost human rights as I crossed state borders.
I wouldnt mind moving out of the US.
I’m not a woman but it’s been my dream for years. Now that I have a child it’s my goal to help him escape.
Quite a few European countries including the UK I believe are starting to develop policies that would help highly educated Americans get citizenship on a fast track scheme. We don’t want a lot of scientific knowledge to go away just because America has decided to fall apart. Come work on our particle accelerators, experimental fusion reactors, or join the European space agency. It would be nice if we could have human space flight independent of Roscosmos and NASA. Maybe we could even beat NASA back to the moon, since I can’t really see Artemis making any progress anytime soon.
I don’t think anyone’s got as far as actually implementing any of these policies yet, but they’re on the way.
I’m sure China would also happily accept Americans, but you might not want to go that route.
Did I mention I have an art degree lol. However my wife is an engineer, I’m trying to convince her but it’s slow going. She doesn’t think it’s as urgent as I do
Same. My wife doesn’t want to be far away from family.
I’ve got 2 kids and I want them to have a better life.
I’ve looked into emigrating and I’m afraid I just don’t have the spoons for it either. Between those 2 hurdles, I don’t know if it’ll ever happen.
Still, there’s potential. We both have degrees. I just hope she doesn’t become a target. She’s a little higher profile.
Makes sense, I’m mostly just trying to determine where to go at this point.
Heyo, I’ve been living abroad over a decade, let me know if you have any questions about how to do it.
Yeah, how to do it?
tldr is “$500 per month income via remote work, choose your first destination, buy a plane ticket.”
I can go into as much detail and provide as much context as you’d like depending on your circumstances and interest, so fire away.
I was really hopeful about new Zealand, but it appears they have their own pedorrists to deal with
You can get by pretty well with just English in Scandinavia, Britain, and Ireland. Many of the big cities also have a lot of English speakers.
The easiest way to move is if you can find a job or have a lot of money to invest. Also sometimes possible to get citizenship through your family. I’d recommend hunting for jobs on LinkedIn if you’re in a specialized field, or see if there are any offices near you for a European company.
If none of that is possible for you, I would recommend moving to a large left-wing city with good trains like NYC, Philadelphia, Portland, etc. They’ll be closer culturally to Europe, less vulnerable to fascism, and may give you more job opportunities toward Europe in the long run.
“Also older women. And younger men. And older men.”
Someone didn’t read the article. Or look at the graphs. Despite the graphs being at the head of the post.
I also want to leave this shithole, there’s nothing good here
Hi, I’ve been living abroad over a decade, feel free to ask me any questions about the process/reality
I believe there are far more decent people here than evil. Hell, look at Trump’s polling numbers: 63% disaprove.
This country has a serious problem with apathy, oppression, and corruption. It’s broken, and it needs to be repaired by a new breed of American that can see a future where others do not.
I’ve been trying to help fix it for like 15+ years at this point, I just genuinely don’t see a path forward. This country was broken long before Trump, and people just didn’t seem to care. Now that it’s starting to personally hurt them, I’ve seen more people start to turn up, but many of them have the attitude of “I can’t wait for this to be over.” I expect as soon as Trump is out and replaced with a Democrat ghoul, a lot of the attendance at the meetings I go to will drop again.
When Balkanization starts getting put on the table as a serious solution that would meaningfully make things better, you know a situation is incredibly fucked.
Saw a Fox News version of this article. The comments were nauseating 🤮
I looked it up. Won’t post a link here, but “Fox” in the search with OP’s title and it comes right up.
The amount of pure cope in the comments is astounding. If 40% of the young women actually did leave, they wouldn’t be so cheery about it.
Who can blame them? From what I’ve seen out of young men and the rise of the “red pill” culture, women are more objectified than ever IMO
Hi folks, I’ve been living abroad for 15 years-ish. If you’re curious about leaving the US, please ask your questions here or in the Travel community.
Living abroad costs about $500 USD per month in most countries.
Most do not have the money but to barely survive.
Traveling costs about $500 USD per month in most countries.
Living abroad is a great way to mitigate financial burden.
I’ve been living in China for 25 years. My salary is 1/10 of what I made in Canada (Ottawa) but I’m much better off than the colleagues I left behind right now.
Congrats, it’s a lot easier to save money and live a comfortable life in China.
I haven’t been to Canada, but I understand the cost of living is not exactly equitable to pay.
Which province are you in?
I live in that city basically nobody outside of China ever heard of until 2020. 😉
Cost of living in Canada has shot up stupidly in Canada in the past two years on top of the already pretty stupid costs vs. salaries. I was making quite a bit of money, but I still had to pay close attention to my budget.
In China my salary is a tenth of what my Canadian salary was 25 years ago and I rarely have to worry about money. It’s quite liberating.
Ha, down in Hubei?
Since you mentioned your salary twice, I’ll play without trying to pry. My guess is you’re doing scientific/industrial work, since there’s no way you could have taken that much of a pay cut if you were an English teacher these days.
Congratulations again on your reduced CoL; it’s the most salient fact about living abroad for most people and the one they find least credible until they’re actually living abroad.
Not having to think about money is the best.
Talking of cost of living, however…
In … I want to say 2007? … an old colleague and his wife visited my SO and me for six weeks. When he got back home he started going over their finances, cringing at the anticipated expenses.
They’d saved money.
They spent a ridiculous sum on airfare. They lived in a hotel near my home for the entire six weeks. We ate out for each meal daily. And yet, when they got home, between the drastic reduction in their utilities usage over the period and the zero cost in groceries for six weeks they came out ahead (by about two weeks, according to his analysis).
No, weirdly. I worked in tech firms, but I did marketing. Switching to teaching English in China was a huge step down in my salary. Now I’m back in marketing, as of 2016, working for a local company as their “cultural expert”. (Officially on paper I’m a PA, but in reality I tend to lead all the stuff related to international things.)
Who can blame them?
