Speaking as one of the 1980s latchkey kids, we don’t allow our adults the time or energy to parent. Nor do we allow anyone the energy to be civically engaged.
Since the 1970s there’s been an onslaught to capture government so it only serves business interests, which allows big business to flourish even when they are run incompetently, or in bad faith.
We are seeing the owner class cannot function even in their own best interests, rather they manage industry entirely on vibes and feels. And the feels usually are I deserve everything and workers are trying to steal from me.
I’ve heard rumors that back in the 90s is was considered normal to work a 20hr part time job and split a 2 bedroom apartment with a friend that also worked 20hrs or so. With a bit left to spare even.
Are there not worthwhile services or items that someone may want to or have to do that don’t profit 50k/yr per person? Should all of those things just go away or be banned?
If there’s work that needs doing, that work should pay a living wage. If it doesn’t, yes, it shouldn’t exist. Raise prices until it can support those workers, and if people won’t buy it at that price, get rid of it. Otherwise, the argument you’re making is that someone needs to do this work, but that person should be destitute.
If someone wants to do something on the side as a hobby, that’s fine, and that’s not what we’re talking about here, obviously.
Lots of things are nice to have’s, almost everything actually. Door greeter, ice cream server, shoe shiner, small gyms, and probably a million more. There are so many small things that by themselves, cannot generate even 2 or 3 employees worth of revenue, which is like at least 250,000 a year. Lots of jobs have to be part time or side hustles, and when you allow that, some people will take those jobs as their primary full time job even though it is not a livable wage.
Sometimes because that’s what’s available, and sometimes because that’s all they can do. If you open that door then someone will walk through it, and if you close that door, I bet a shit ton of things we all enjoy would disappear.
For better or worse, without UBI, there will be jobs that don’t and cannot pay a living wage, that will exist, that people would like to exist, and that people will do. Any rules or sentiment surrounding that must take all that into account.
A lot of jobs only exist because we need people to be working. There’s no societal need for a door greeter. If your ice cream shop doesn’t generate enough revenue to pay someone working there a living wage, it isn’t a viable business, or your prices are too low.
You mention UBI and really, that’s the answer, but without it, everyone needs to work to survive and when there isn’t enough work that needs doing, we invent bullshit work just to say we’re employing someone.
And this is how we get Amazon as the only source of ice cream, and no other social pleasantries to make it cost effective or viable. Everyone here is just virtue signaling, the reality is shit would collapse or at least consolidate to total garbage without low wage jobs. The only solution is UBI, and that can work in societies with extreme logistical excess who also have a culture that wants to help the less fortunate. That’s surely not the US.
Low-wage jobs are just exploiting desperate people. If the cost of living were more reasonable, it wouldn’t be an issue - it doesn’t need to be an ice cream shop paying $40 / hr, it needs to be housing and necessities being cost-limited or subsidized. Subsidies for necessities and increased taxes on luxuries would help.
Most of these services are exactly the places that expect the most demanding work for the lowest pay. Easy to fix: make sure the c-suite does not get more than 10x of the lowest salary in the company, and suddenly there is enough money available for a living wage.
*from a single job.
Every full time job should pay a living wage.
Unless ‘full-time’ is 30 hours a week or less, even a part-time job should be enough to earn a living.
In some countries it actually is, but mentioning that would be communist propaganda.
It really should be 20 hours or less.
Speaking as one of the 1980s latchkey kids, we don’t allow our adults the time or energy to parent. Nor do we allow anyone the energy to be civically engaged.
Since the 1970s there’s been an onslaught to capture government so it only serves business interests, which allows big business to flourish even when they are run incompetently, or in bad faith.
We are seeing the owner class cannot function even in their own best interests, rather they manage industry entirely on vibes and feels. And the feels usually are I deserve everything and workers are trying to steal from me.
I’ve heard rumors that back in the 90s is was considered normal to work a 20hr part time job and split a 2 bedroom apartment with a friend that also worked 20hrs or so. With a bit left to spare even.
Not sure how true it is
Are there not worthwhile services or items that someone may want to or have to do that don’t profit 50k/yr per person? Should all of those things just go away or be banned?
If there’s work that needs doing, that work should pay a living wage. If it doesn’t, yes, it shouldn’t exist. Raise prices until it can support those workers, and if people won’t buy it at that price, get rid of it. Otherwise, the argument you’re making is that someone needs to do this work, but that person should be destitute.
If someone wants to do something on the side as a hobby, that’s fine, and that’s not what we’re talking about here, obviously.
Lots of things are nice to have’s, almost everything actually. Door greeter, ice cream server, shoe shiner, small gyms, and probably a million more. There are so many small things that by themselves, cannot generate even 2 or 3 employees worth of revenue, which is like at least 250,000 a year. Lots of jobs have to be part time or side hustles, and when you allow that, some people will take those jobs as their primary full time job even though it is not a livable wage. Sometimes because that’s what’s available, and sometimes because that’s all they can do. If you open that door then someone will walk through it, and if you close that door, I bet a shit ton of things we all enjoy would disappear. For better or worse, without UBI, there will be jobs that don’t and cannot pay a living wage, that will exist, that people would like to exist, and that people will do. Any rules or sentiment surrounding that must take all that into account.
A lot of jobs only exist because we need people to be working. There’s no societal need for a door greeter. If your ice cream shop doesn’t generate enough revenue to pay someone working there a living wage, it isn’t a viable business, or your prices are too low.
You mention UBI and really, that’s the answer, but without it, everyone needs to work to survive and when there isn’t enough work that needs doing, we invent bullshit work just to say we’re employing someone.
And this is how we get Amazon as the only source of ice cream, and no other social pleasantries to make it cost effective or viable. Everyone here is just virtue signaling, the reality is shit would collapse or at least consolidate to total garbage without low wage jobs. The only solution is UBI, and that can work in societies with extreme logistical excess who also have a culture that wants to help the less fortunate. That’s surely not the US.
Amazing how some countries have much more survivable minimum wages, more vacation time, low cost health care, and still have local ice cream shops
And I’m just talking about Western European nations
Low-wage jobs are just exploiting desperate people. If the cost of living were more reasonable, it wouldn’t be an issue - it doesn’t need to be an ice cream shop paying $40 / hr, it needs to be housing and necessities being cost-limited or subsidized. Subsidies for necessities and increased taxes on luxuries would help.
Most of these services are exactly the places that expect the most demanding work for the lowest pay. Easy to fix: make sure the c-suite does not get more than 10x of the lowest salary in the company, and suddenly there is enough money available for a living wage.