Look, I actually have to spend my time around Americans. I dislike them probably more than a lot of people who say stuff like in [https://www.reddit.com/r/TankieTheDeprogram/s/eHww4UALHm](this thread). But it’s not out of lack of trying.
But that’s besides the point. No other country’s people gets treated this way. And no, I’m not going to say I’m more oppressed than people in the global south or whatever. In fact a lot of psychological problems result from the fact that I’m privileged to be in the global north.
But Americans are so often…dismissed. That’s the only term i can come up with. But everyone talks about it in such idealist matter. They always talk individuals or idealism or whatever. The closest to material analysis is “the proletariat’s material conditions are closer aligned to the imperialist Bourgeoisie.” But that doesn’t just apply to Americans.
But, look. Why doesn’t any other people get treated this way? Genuinely. I don’t think Stalin sat down and said “well Germany lost a major world war and went through multiple economic crises and still hasn’t had a socialist revolution. So obviously it’s a lost cause, kill all of them.” Japan and South Korea are never treated this way, despite being very arguably in similar boats. And if we want to talk about material conditions, what about Indonesia or Iran or Cambodia or so many other nations? They haven’t had socialist revolutions yet despite their material conditions, so does that mean these people are useless treatlerites too?
I’m sorry. I know, again, we’re in the imperial core, we’re privileged. I don’t know what part of my mentally ill brain it is, but it’s just that the logic completely fails for me and that gives me anxiety, because reasons. Not just that, but the actual oppression of the communist and self determination movements here are also just ignored.
I don’t mind “death to amerikkka.” I have no love for the country. Its just…the people? I mean I get it. I deal with it every week. I see it with my own eyes. And yet, I still believe, because it’s all the same structure. It’s all the same problems we’ve been dealing with for hundreds of years. It’s not really all that different.
And then the other part is just acting like we don’t have problems here. Like ICE is literally abducting people off the street, I’m afraid for my family’s safety and actively trying to find ways to get them out and trying to convince them to get out, and over half the country lives below the poverty line. It’s not *the worst," and I’ll never claim that, but not everyone is a TikTok girly living in a New York apartment drinking Starbucks every day.
An org in my city was just recently talking about how theyve gotten hundreds of new visitors, and they literally just started last year. They’re not DSA, they’re a genuine marxist org. I want to try, that’s all
So there’s no real benefit to pretending or writing apologia for them, right? This is not a path of idealism, so lets let go of that before it gets in the way.
Can you simplify / clarify this? I feel like there a multiple interpretations and I don’t like relying on my own assumptions.
I really don’t think there’s anyone here who isn’t acutely aware of there late-stage capitalist rot the empire has been experiencing. From worsening to material conditions to state violence, I think you’ll find plenty of people here that may as well be experts in the matter, as much as such a thing exists.
Is that what you think the tankie critique of america is?
Hatred of the US empire really isn’t incompatible with that. I don’t see why, as a marxist, you wouldn’t share the perspective the rest of the world has about where you probably had no choice in being born. The rest of the world hates and fears the violent depravity of your country for pretty obvious reasons. You’re not obligated to try to soften that image for the sake of optimism, but you will re-enforce your reputation as a specific liberal stereotype if you do.